Comparative Mythology speculations of MithrandirOlorin
I shall discus comparative mythology from an admittedly amateur perspective. I haven't actually read Joseph Campbell for example. It's a also a Christian perspective, but one the seeks not fall into pseudo History traps many of my fellow Christians fall into. The name of this log may change sometimes, but the URL won't.
Monday, March 14, 2022
Reincarnation originates in Western Mysticism actually.
Saturday, November 13, 2021
King Midas might be mentioned in The Bible
Isaiah chapter 14 verse 4 after directing the Prophet's attention specifically to the King of Babylon says in the KJV "How hath the Oppressor ceased! how hath the Golden City ceased!". In the Young's Literal Translation "Golden City" reads "Golden One". This is two English words being used to translate one word in the Hebrew, a word that the Strongs Concordance says actually means "Gold Making".
The word in question is Madhebah, it's core root is Dhab the Aramaic word for Gold used in passages like Daniel 2 and 3, it's related to the equivalent Hebrew word Zahab. A Mem as a prefix typically carried the meaning of "from". And a Heh at the end as a suffix tends to make a word feminine, but scholars tend to feel that doesn't necessarily imply anything about the Gender of who or what's being referred to unless it's a personal name.
When you remember the lack of Vowels in the Hebrew Alphabet, and how the "S" at the end of a name in Greek transliterations are usually not part of the original name. A connection between this word and Midas (called Mita in Assyrian inscriptions) is plausible. Hebrew authors with a poetic style like Isaiah often give foreign Kings names that are on some level Hebrew word play, so I'm not saying the form here is the original. And I don't think I need to explain how Midas is a name associated with Gold.
There was a historical Midas who did rule Phrygia and reigned around 700 BC, contemporary with Isaiah. The Classical Greeks tended to consider that Midas the second Midas and attributed their legends of a King Midas to someone who lived way before the Trojan War. But Homer himself makes no allusion to a past Midas when talking about the Trojan War (and I've recently come to support the 808 BC date for the fall of Troy). The Greek myths of Midas are I feel clearly fantastical myths inspired by the 700 BC Midas who the Greeks pushed further back into the mythical past.
Some Greek sources also claim the Wife of the 700 BC Midas was the first to mint coins. Modern historians scoff at that idea, feeling confident no coinage existed prior to Lydian innovation nearly 200 years later. But if this early coinage experiment used Gold rather then Silver coins, then I suspect all those coins were eventually melted down to be used for other things, especially after Silver coins became standard, explaining the lack of an archeological record for them.
Thus the 700 BC Midas would be the origin of the name's association with Gold. And it was actually his Wife, a Female, who did the "Gold Making".
But Midas wasn't the King of Babylon, so why mention him here? Leaving aside my belief that the ultimate final fulfilment of this Prophecy is still yet future, which is the kind of thing I discus on a different blog where I have been flirting with the idea of eschatological Babylon being Turkey since before I even discovered this.
Midas was also in conflict with Assyria during the same time Isaiah's contemporary King of Babylon was, and was eventually also defeated and his capital city Gordium/Gordion was in turn destroyed by the Cimmerians in 695 BC not long before Assyria destroyed Babylon in 691 or 689 BC fulfilling Isaiah 21. So Isaiah could have been throwing in a reference to an ally of Babylon.
But maybe Gordion also had a Temple that was thought of as a "Gate of the gods" or "House of Heaven" similarly to Temples of Enlil and Marduk in Mesopotamia?
Tuesday, June 1, 2021
Sailor Scouts, Japanese Planet Names and their Greco-Roman counterparts
Sailor Mercury is the Sailor Scout who’s elemental association is most likely to seem pretty random to western fans. The Planet Mercury is quite probably the driest rock in the solar system, and Hermes wasn’t particularly associated with water either. However when you dig into Sailor Moon more you learn that for most of the Senshi their Civilian surnames reference the Japanese names of their Planets.
Sailor Mercury is Ami Mizuno. Mizuno means “of water” the Kanji Mizu also pronounced Sui depending on context, means Water, and Suisei is the Japanese name of Mercury which means Water Star. This is perhaps based on ancient Japanese beliefs about the planet from long before they were exposed to Western Astronomy.
However what I feel like drawing attention to is that there is at least one ancient Gaijin precedent for associating the planet Mercury with Water. The Sumerian deity associated with the planet we call Mercury was Enki, and Enki was also associated with Water and the Seas, his Temple in Eridu being called the Abzu, he was in a lot of ways arguably the Poseidon/Neptune figure of the Mesopotamian pantheon, and was also conflated with the Canaanite Yam.
However he was also associated with some of the same things Hermes and Thoth were associated with, Knowledge and Learning and Intelligence. And those traits are also why Ami Mizuno is still considered justifiably a Hermes type personality.
While Sailor Mercury might be the first one we think of as odd, Sailor Mars who's civilian name is Rei Hino is not what I’d expect a western writer to do with that planet either. Her color is Red so that fits, but she’s not really the most Soldier or Warlike of the group, the 90s Anime does give her those Tsundere traits but I don’t see that as actually making someone good at War. And I don’t know of many other contexts where Ares is associated with Fire.
Oracles/Prophetesses in Greek Mythology tend to be associated with Apollo like Cassandra and the Pythia of Delphi, but the implied vow of Chastity in her status as a Miko could make one think of his twin Artemis, as well as one of her attacks taking the shape of a Bow and Arrow.
But as you might have guessed by now, Hino means “of fire” and the Japanese name for Mars is Kasei which means Fire Star.
Interestingly associating a Prophetess with Fire actually makes sense to me Biblically. In The Bible Prophets are vessels of The Holy Spirit, and the Baptism of The Holy Spirit is with Fire (Luke 3:16-17 and Matthew 2:10-11). A Fire that purges one of Sin (Malachi 3:3) because God’s punishments are for correction (Habakkuk 1:12 and Proverbs 3:11). Hence “in the name of Mars I will chastise you”.
Sailor Jupiter/Makoto Kino is where things start to make more sense, since she can call down Thunder to smite her foes. But most of her attacks are actually more Grass type making it difficult to find a good Pokémon to represent her, there are no Electric/Grass hybrids yet that I’m aware of. As far as analyzing her personality traits go, she’s almost more like Hera than Zeus.
Kino means “of Wood” and the Japanese name for Jupiter is Mokusei which means Wood Star.
Now I know many might jump to saying she’s the actual Mars of the group since she’s the one with a reputation for kicking @$$ even when a normal human. However that is something that is far more stressed in the 90s Anime than it is in the original Manga, the Manga does indeed introduce her with a Sukeban vibe, but it’s more interested in how that outward appearance is misleading.
Sailor Venus is the only one of the four Inner Senshi where her Greco-Roman namesake is explicitly evoked with her quite often calling herself the Goddess of Love. And her surname isn’t a reference to Kinsei the Japanese name for Venus but instead is Aino meaning “of Love”. However Kinsei means “Gold Star” and Sailor Venus is definitely associated with Gold in terms of her color palate and her weapons.
And yet, Minako is in fact the most Soldier minded of the group, as a result of being the first who’s Moon Kingdom memories returned. However this is most stressed in the Manga and almost completely ignored by the 90s Anime where her Sword is removed from the story. Minako is Aphrodite, but she is Aphrodite Areia.
Overly Sarcastic Productions has a video on Aphrodite going over how she descends from Astarte, Ishtar and Inanna. One of the topics discussed is how Ishtar was a Goddess of both Love and War but how Aphrodite in Greece only kept that aspect in Sparta. There are some important things left out. The role Cyprus plays is Astarte’s journey to the west (which also hindered their Pygmalion video). And I feel an argument can be made that this separating the War Goddess from the Love Goddess was already starting in the Middle East and was not solely a result of Greek gender norms. In Canaanite/West Semitic texts like those found at Ugarite, Astarte does not still have any Warlike characteristics if Anath exists as a separate distinct Goddess. And while no Anath equivalent exists in Mesopotamia, I would argue in Greece she exists as Enyo, a War Goddess consort of Ares. I was going to also mention Adrestia, an alleged daughter of Ares and Aphrodite, but I’ve found no primary source evidence that she existed in Ancient Greece, it seems she’s a modern invention of the Internet like the Time Traveling Goatfish.
Sparta allowing Aphrodite to be a War Goddess didn’t stop them from viewing Human Warfare as strictly for men. But they did think their women should be Fit, Athletic and capable of defending the home while their husbands are away. The only Women to ever compete in the Ancient Olympics were from Sparta. So Minako being the one who does sports kind of fits that.
Ya know those Ancient Greece themed Sexy Halloween Costumes designed to keep the woman's Legs fully visible? Well in actual Ancient Greece that was only acceptable in Sparta.
Ultimately though my ideal Aesthetic for Aphrodite Areia isn’t quite anyone from Sailor Moon but the Magical Girl Warrior costumes from Ai Tenshi Wedding Peach, who’s Anime had the same character designer as the first 2 seasons of the 90s Sailor Moon Anime and the Promise of The Rose movie and now the Eternal films.
Friday, March 20, 2020
Could the Canaanite Asherah be a Gaia figure?
But I'm currently most interested in the picture that begins to form when you simply translate the main names of the Baal Cycle characters into Greek. Mot becomes Thanatos (Death), and since Yam is a male deity he becomes Pontos (Sea). This points us in the direction of equating them with the Greek Primordial Deities.
This doesn't work for all of them of course, El, Asherah, Baal Hadad, Astarte and Anath are ones who's names' translations aren't known deity names in Greek.
There is no Deity in the Canaanite pantheon named Heaven or Earth, so Ouranos is one who's a little up for grabs. El is usually identified with Anu in Mesopotamia which works for making him Ouranos, but Enlil is also a god of the Heavens in a sense and he's typically Baal-Hadad in Canaanite comparisons. Aphrodite is definitely one of the Greek deities to come from Astarte, but in my view so is Eos and in some contexts Selene and Asteria. When looking for an Astarte among the Primordial deities I can't help but think Philotes works best, and she is sometimes equated with Aphrodite, while Eris is similarly equated with Enyo making them work as Anath. Given how Astarte herself is sometimes a War deity (like Aphrodite Areia) maybe Anath was not originally a separate goddess?
I feel like the way we casually think of Asherah and Astarte often swaps them. Like when one tries to argue Asherah is the "Queen of Heaven" of Jeremiah even though that title is Inana/Ishtar in Mesopotamia. And then people want to think of Astarte as a fertility goddess because of her association with Baal.
The Asherah Poles aka Asherim are similar to Celtic Maypoles, they are an aspect of nature worship. Meanwhile if El is Anu in Mesopotamia then his wives (who I think were all originally different names or titles of the same goddess) are Gaia figures. Ki and Uras both mean Earth, and Nammu is identified as the mother of deities elsewhere called Anunaki, a name that clearly makes them children of Ki, and Antu is a feminine form of Anu like Elat as a title of Asherah. And in Greek Theogonies Gaia is the mother of Pontos just as Asherah is refereed to as the mother of Yam. Then Lotan could be the basis for Thammus, Porchys & Keto and their children including Ladon.
If we went with Ouranos as Baal-Hadad rather then then El then who is El? I'm thinking probably Eros if the original Theogeny is in fact the one that makes Eros the first god. Asherah is in different contexts seemingly both the mother and a consort of Baal-Hadad, which fits the relationship between Ouranos and Gaia quite well.
If we went with Ouranos as El then maybe Baal-Hadad would be Cronos, or Dagan as Cronos and Baal-Hadad as Zeus?
Monday, May 27, 2019
The Fall of Gondolin and the Fall of Troy
Tolkien certainly may have read that, but given what his overall goals and interests were in developing his Arda mythology, I think the reference to Troy in Snorri Sturluson's Prose Edda is far more likely to be the main account of Troy that Tolkien would have drawn on.
Like in Bruce's Aeneid theory it has Turgon as Priam and Idril Celebrindel as a daughter of Priam. But Tuor would instead be Múnón or Mennón. There is some disagreement on who in the earlier accounts of Troy Múnón is based on, he could be the Menon mentioned in Book 12 of the Illiad. But the more popular fan theory is that he's Memnon.
Memnon lead an army of "Aethiopians" to Troy from the East. Aethiopia in Greek Mythology didn't quite always mean the kingdom(s) in Africa south of Egypt, Homer said there were Aethiopians at both the far Western and Eastern ends of the Earth. Being called a "Son of the Dawn" implies Memnon came from the East. Remember during the time of Tuor from the Elves POV Men had only just recently entered Beleriand from the East.
However the key detail that I think Sturluson's version of Troy has in common with Gondolin that I don't think any other version does is having Twelve Houses.
Near the earth's centre was made that goodliest of homes and haunts that ever have been, which is called Troy, even that which we call Turkland. This abode was much more gloriously made than others, and fashioned with more skill of craftsmanship in manifold wise, both in luxury and in the wealth which was there in abundance. There were twelve kingdoms and one High King, and many sovereignties belonged to each kingdom; in the stronghold were twelve chieftains.This same description is why I sometimes think Sturluson was just using Troy as a stand in for Jerusalem, but but that may just be me.
Of Gondolin's 12 Houses Tuor became Captain of the White Wing.
Sunday, March 17, 2019
Sword Art Online and Gnosticism
Mako-Chan @JaredMithrandir 15m15 minutes ago
The way#SAO#Alicization is using the word#Soul makes more sense when your aware that the#Greek word translated#Soul in the#NewTestament is#Psyche.
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The TVTropes page UsefulNotes/Gnosticism claims Gnostic influence on a number of Anime and Video Games that I don't feel hold up. Especially Evangelion (though I do defend that it's use of religious imagery isn't meaningless) and Final Fantasy VII which is as far the opposite of a Gnostic attitude as you can get. Revolutionary Girl Utena is the one that holds up, well so does Serial Experiments Lain which I'm not sure was always there.
SAO isn't mentioned there even though I feel it's more applicable to SAO then it is to most they do mention.
First you need to understand that Platonic and Gnostic views of the world are in modern times highly related to the Simulation hypothesis, which frankly is also most of the basis for seeing The Matrix as Gnostic. When talking about the first episode of season 2 Digibro mocks Kirito's suggestion that the real world might be no different from a Virtual World by saying something like "the real world doesn't disappear if you pull a plug". However the response to that is pretty easy, what if "God" pulled a plug? Ironically in his No Game No Life video from 2018 Digi seems to suddenly support a form of Simulation Hypothesis by quoting Elon Musk.
The first arc of SAO is kind of the proper Gnostic Allegory philosophically, since everyone is Sophia in that situation. But the Alfheim arc while very problematic is the purest allegory of Gnostic mythology with Asuna as Sophia and the villain as a true Demiurge, not a true Creator but merely fiddling around with what Kaiba created.
I'm not gonna go any deeper then that today, I'm hoping to inspire further discussion of the topic from people more qualified then I am to talk about it.
Friday, February 1, 2019
Sauron and Azazel
Now up front I want to remind people that I’m aware Tolkien hated direct Allegory, like George Lucas he drew on many mythological concepts and motifs, but nothing was meant to be a one to one allegory, even Morgoth’s connection to Satan comes with qualifications (first of which is that it's more of a Paradise Lost perception of Satan then anything The Bible clearly teaches).
Also the development of Sauron as a figure in Tolkien’s Mythology was uniquely complicated. I personally suspect that before Tolkien actually began writing a sequel to The Hobbit, Sauron’s roles in the tale of Beren and Luthien, in the Fall of Numenor and as the Necromancer mentioned in The Hobbit were three completely separate characters. For example in the case of Beren and Luthien the role eventually taken by Sauron was originally just a Werecat type monster. But it’s none of those proto-Saurons I’m comparing to Azazel here, this is specifically about Sauron as The Lord of The Rings.
There are conflicting traditions about Azazel, sometimes that name is just used as another name for Satan, which could very well be the original intent behind it’s use in Leviticus 16. This analysis is mainly about the figure of Azazel as he appears in The Book of Enoch aka First Enoch. The Richard Laurence Translation was published in 1883 and the R.H. Charles translation was published in 1917, so both are books Tolkien could have read at some point.
When I first read the Book of Enoch, I couldn’t help but notice how much Azazel’s role stood out narratively. In the initial list of the leaders of the Grigori/Watchers that fell (chapter 7 verse 9 in the Laurence version and chapter 6 verse 7 in the Charles version) Azazel’s name isn’t included, in either the Ethiopic or Aramaic texts. Yet when Azazel is first mentioned in chapter 8 verse 1 he is suddenly being treated as one of the single most important of them.
Then in chapter 10 verses 4-12 he’s given a uniquely different fate, being buried under rocks in Dudael rather then being chained in the Abyss/Tartarus like the others. I eventually learned some of that uniqueness is a product of how the name is used in Leviticus 16 and traditions derived from that, but it still stands out. If you think you can explain this by just saying Azazel and Samyaza/Shemjaza are different names for the same Angel, the Aramaic text of chapter 8 lists Shemjaza separately as the one who taught Sorcery. And Chapter 9 lists them separately in both versions.
In The Enemy section of The Valaquenta in the published Silmarillion, the only Maia who joined Morgoth singled out for special mention are the Balrogs as a group and Sauron as an individual. One Youtube video I watched on the Balrogs theorized their special status among Morgoth’s followers might be that they were the very first Maia to follow him. Sauron meanwhile came much later, never openly betraying the Valar till after Angband was firmly established. So even the difference between Sauron and the Balrogs echos the difference between Azazel and the Grigori.
But the crux of why I feel this comparison works is what’s said in Chapter 8 Verse 1 of the Book of Enoch.
"And Azâzêl taught men to make swords, and knives, and shields, and breastplates, and made known to them the metals 〈of the earth〉 and the art of working them, and bracelets, and ornaments, and the use of antimony, and the beautifying of the eyelids, and all kinds of costly stones, and all colouring tinctures."That certainly sounds like he’d be a Maia of Aule (as both Sauron and Saruman were) if placed in Tolkien’s Cosmology. In fact it’s tempting to see even the Rings of Power themselves in that verse.
I also can’t help but wonder if Dudael where Azazel met his final doom being traditionally placed East of Jerusalem is echoed in Mordor being East of Gondor.
Another possible mythological influence on Sauron were various pagan gods associated with Blacksmithing and/or Volcanoes. If you were to compare the Valar to the Olympians then Aule would be Hephaestus/Vulcan, yet Sauron ultimately resembles Hephaestus more since Hephaestus was cast down from Olympus. Typhon is a figure in Greek mythology some scholars suspect was originally the same as or an aspect of Hephaestus, one of his birth stories is the same, being borne by Hera in response to the birth of Athena. Also in some versions Typhon is buried beneath Mt Etna a Volcano on Sicily which is also said to be the location of Hephaestus's workshop.
Is it possible to connect Hephaestus/Typhon to Azazel independent of comparing them to a modern literary figure? I think so, like for example winding up buried, and of course Azazel’s status as a craftsman already mentioned above. That the Greeks identified Typhon with Set gives precedence for seeing him as a Desert Storm god. I feel the Book of Enoch definitely developed post Hellenization, it’s mentioning Tartaros is evidence of that. There was a blacksmith god in the Canaanite pantheon, Kothar-wa-Khasis, but he wasn’t cast out like Hephaestus was. So I think the figure of Azazel in the book of Enoch was possibly modeled a bit after Hephaestus and/or Typhon.
So maybe Tolkien likewise consciously or unconsciously made the same connection between them?